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Noah Sinking Senior member Posts: 1220		how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 6, 2008 12:10 PM. Post 1
		Would it have been smarter do you think to flat call his pre-flop bet with the intention to push on the flop in this situation? TEXAS_HOLDEM, NO_LIMIT, T4-71470136-182 played at "Mwanza" for USD TC from 2008-07-06 11:56 until 2008-07-06 11:57 Seat 1: Hels Bels ($7,971 in chips) Seat 3: stackermoose ($4,160 in chips) Seat 5: Noah Sinking ($10,587 in chips) Seat 6: Schooter69 ($4,712 in chips) Seat 7: tricky40 x ($6,570 in chips) ANTES/BLINDS stackermoose posts blind ($200), Noah Sinking posts blind ($400). PRE-FLOP Schooter69 bets $1,000, tricky40 x folds, Hels Bels folds, stackermoose folds, Noah Sinking bets $5,500, Schooter69 calls $3,712 and is all-in. FLOP [board cards: QD 4D 4S ] TURN [board cards: QD 4D 4S JH ] RIVER [board cards: QD 4D 4S JH 7D ] SHOWDOWN Noah Sinking shows [ TS TC ] Schooter69 shows [ JC KC ] Noah Sinking wins $1,188, Schooter69 wins $9,624. SUMMARY Dealer: Hels Bels Pot: $10,812 Hels Bels, loses $0 stackermoose, loses $200 Noah Sinking, loses $4,712 Schooter69, bets $4,712, collects $9,624, net $4,912 tricky40 x, loses $0

sufur Enthusiast Posts: 2355		RE: how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 6, 2008 12:17 PM. Post 2
		No, well played. Bad call by schoot, lucky enough for him he got a race. Unlucky for you the tens didn't hold. I wouldn't raise so much normally but I like just putting him all in when there's nobody to act after you. I'd prob make it 2500-3000 in a different situation.

Noah Sinking Senior member Posts: 1220		RE: how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 6, 2008 12:20 PM. Post 3
		I've been in that situation often and generally do the same thing I did there. But on those occasions he draws his card on the turn or river I always think had I only flat called and pushed on whatever flopped that he might have folded and saved me a bad beat.

_spiderpig_ Senior member Posts: 754		RE: how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 6, 2008 12:47 PM. Post 4
		i also think you played it right, as if you have of flat called you would have been worried bout the Q on flop, just UL noah

marsvolta77 Senior member Posts: 709		RE: how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 8, 2008 04:52 AM. Post 5
		wow... this guy opens KJs utg with 5 people left and 12 BB's. Unbelievably bad... so bad. If I knew that he was this spewy/loose, i'd shove approx 77+, AJs+, AQ+ vs a tighter/better player, i'd push 99+, AK. Id never stop and go here.... you've still got plenty of chips. if you had about 8 to 10 BB's then you can start to think about the stop n go (but in general, you should use it rarely)

Bangkoker Enthusiast Posts: 619		RE: how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 8, 2008 05:07 AM. Post 6
		^^^^ All of the above, I would shove there if villain has been making similar raises from UTG. Just unlucky.

Jonny Chip Enthusiast Posts: 885		RE: how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 8, 2008 04:49 PM. Post 7
		its amazing how much ppl over rate KJ, especially sooted. Spider makes a good point, if you had flat called and he came at you after the flop u prob would have folded as you prob wouldnt have put him on KJ with an UTG raise like that Just ul IMO

John_Bender Enthusiast Posts: 498		RE: how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 13, 2008 03:26 AM. Post 8
		I dont think his raise is loose at all, 5 handed. I would probably raise it aswell. However, he was by no means pot-committed and I think his call is pretty horrible...

Bodhidharma4 Member Posts: 22		RE: how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 19, 2008 08:36 PM. Post 9
		Personaly i'd have called him then put him all in after the flop with only 1 over card out there. When you put him all in before the flop you give him 5 cards to make a hand, where as moving in after the flop not only gives him only 3 cards to make a hand, but gives you the chance to escape if 2 or 3 over cards fall. If you move in after the flop and he's holding a queen it doesn't really matter as you would have lost anyway so there is no way if could have got me to fold with that flop.

crookdcue Enthusiast Posts: 138		RE: how to deal with standard raise preflop holding decent pair Jul 20, 2008 03:01 AM. Post 10
		played fine by you. KJ suited or not utg in a 5 handed game is marginal imo. it's not a terrible raise but not good either because with that stack ur pretty much committed to go all the way if reraised with a hand that is owned by nearly everything that is reraising you. as played you did nothing wrong and just were unlucky it didn't hold. it was pretty much a hand that plays itself though, nothing complicated about it. flatting TT there is worse than raising KJ imo.